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EP. REVIEW: Spice & Wolf: merchant meets the wise wolf


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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 4433
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2024 9:38 am Reply with quote
Tanteikingdomkey wrote:
To be fair to the original show, chloe was in the original show, they just changed the gender of the guy we now see in episode 1 and implied that she had been romantically interested in Lawrence (in the non existent time, when she was supposed to be his apprentice).

I was expecting a lot more talk about that and the flash forward scene since we did have those be new elements to the story. or heck I was expecting some talk of the plot or what happened in the episodes. I am not saying this is a bad review at all just that it is different then I had expected it to be.


I was definitely taken off-guard with the very first thing being something from the end, even if they barely hid who it is. It's a bit spoilery if somebody doesn't know, but almost comes off as an acknowledgment that people do know where things are headed. It sort of made me wonder who the the intended audience is. They went back to the beginning instead of a third season so anyone new can get into it, but lead off with that?
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Key
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2024 11:05 am Reply with quote
Greed1914 wrote:
I was definitely taken off-guard with the very first thing being something from the end, even if they barely hid who it is. It's a bit spoilery if somebody doesn't know, but almost comes off as an acknowledgment that people do know where things are headed. It sort of made me wonder who the the intended audience is. They went back to the beginning instead of a third season so anyone new can get into it, but lead off with that?

Hadn't really thought about it that way, but this is, I think, a very good point. Feels like the production staff is throwing a bone to established fans while seeking new ones.
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Snowcat



Joined: 01 Feb 2021
Posts: 190
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2024 1:56 pm Reply with quote
Fluwm wrote:

I don't think anyone's suggesting they plan on adapting so much all in one go. Rather, there's an expectation (based on the obvious assumption) that they plan on making a "Spice and Wolf II," and "Spice and Wolf III" and so on in the following years, to fully adapt -- as much as possible -- the remaining novels. And god knows there's plenty of material to animate.

It's my hope that they would finally adapt the complete story. People need to watch this show and support it !

The problem with so much comparison with the original in the review: now, I want to re-watch the original adaptation to compare, in particular for the music. I found the music from Kevin Penkin excellent in this new version, and it wasn't the aspect that catch me in the first version probably because the story was new at that time. I will probably end watching the 2 versions this season.
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jr240483



Joined: 24 Dec 2005
Posts: 4379
Location: New York City,New York,USA
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2024 2:51 am Reply with quote
rfletcher wrote:
Piglet the Grate wrote:
Are we going to get as much ecchi as Passione Co., Ltd. put into Hinako Note?


I'm going to guess not? The nudity was front-loaded in this story, so I don't imagine we're going to get anything more detailed than we got in the first two episodes.

(Though speaking of the nudity, can't help noticing Passione took the amount they removed from Holo's ears and added it... elsewhere. Holo is a lot less waif-ish this go-round, let's just say.)

So happy to hear discussion of the original soundtrack. I imported both volumes from Japan before they went out of print, and they still enthrall me all these years later. I like what the new one is doing so far, playing up a mystical, almost new-agey feel more than the period instruments so effectively used previously. I sense another import in my future - different soundtracks for different moods, I guess.

I'm far too biased to compare the OP/EDs. The OP of the first season of S&W was one of those rare, magical moments when I knew, just from that music, that I was in for a wonderful journey. (Of course, I thought the same thing when I first heard the OP for Fractale, and... yeah...)

My biggest fear with this being a remake and not a continuation is that we will get two cours and then done, with minimal new ground covered. If memory serves, there was never a third season because of poor disc sales in Japan - will this time be any different? Has the model changed enough in those 15 years that disc sales are not the prime determination for a continuation?

I guess I'll stay tuned.


unless the source materials had that amount of fully uncensored nudity in abundance, (considering that both the light novels and the manga had gotten the MA FOR MATURE AUDIENCES ONLY rating ) i highly doubt it.

also passione wont take any chances and go full ecchi let alone "softcore hentai fanservice mode" like on their other anime projects on a series as legendary as this and risk facing massive backlash by the die hard light novel community let alone the anime community as a whole!

spice and wolf is DEFINITELY no interspecies reviewers let alone worlds end harem or harem in the labrynth of another world (which were also producex by passione)
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AnimeFlyz



Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 366
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2024 7:24 am Reply with quote
Key wrote:
AnimeFlyz wrote:
This remake is extremely necessary considering the OG anime butchered parts of the early novels and its age really shows on rewatch.

I won't dispute your latter point, but aside from Chloe assuming Yarei's role, where did this supposed "butchering" take place? Both seasons and the OVA were otherwise very faithful to the source novels they adapted.


[EDIT: Spoiler tags added because you should NOT assume that everyone following this thread is familiar with the original series or source novels. - Key]

Season 2 being a bigger offender than Season 1. The anime seems to change things to heavily focus on the romantic subplot of Lawrence and Holo while cutting stuff that has no effect on it. The whole Yarei turning into Chloe thing is an obvious change. spoiler[Season 2 though takes the Pyrite Scheme arc and drags it out way longer than needed in order to add way more romantic focused drama with Amati. Then there is the complete skip of the Terio arc because its an arc that has pretty much 0 effect on the relationship of our two protagonists, but that doesn't make it skippable, considering that Diane in the previous arc gives our protags a lead to get more info about Holo's home which is their entire motivation for visiting Terio. Plus its kinda an issue to not introduced a character who comes back into the story later. ]

Then there is spoiler[the Fur Trade arc] which they decided to skip to instead, which literally has no ending in the anime. The 2nd Season pretty much ends on a "cliff hanger" with no satisfying conclusion. spoiler[The Fur Trade arc involving Eve takes up another 3 Volumes of content.] Its just a really bad place to end a show on with no continuation in sight. Hopefully if the Remake does well, we dont run into these same problems.
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Key
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2024 8:45 am Reply with quote
AnimeFlyz wrote:
A lot of spoilery stuff

Skipping novel 4 makes total sense if they were never intending to animate past the second season, as novel 5 emphasized the romantic aspects more, and that was a core element of the second season in particular.

Novel 3 was adapted at the same pace as novel 2, so if you're going to complain about things being dragged out then that argument also applies to all of s1. And while I suppose I can agree that the anime version did emphasize the romance aspect a bit more, the romance aspect was definitely there in the novel. There may have been some minor omissions (which will always be true in LN adaptations) but not wholesale changes, so saying that the story was "butchered" is a gross overstatement.

S2 of the original anime was in my Top 10 list for the decade, and later reading the novels (they weren't out yet in the States at the time the series aired) didn't change that impression.

jr240483 wrote:
unless the source materials had that amount of fully uncensored nudity in abundance, (considering that both the light novels and the manga had gotten the MA FOR MATURE AUDIENCES ONLY rating ) i highly doubt it.

also passione wont take any chances and go full ecchi let alone "softcore hentai fanservice mode" like on their other anime projects on a series as legendary as this and risk facing massive backlash by the die hard light novel community let alone the anime community as a whole!

After episode 2, there's one other place in the first cour where there might be a little nudity, and after that, only a handful of other cases in the entire rest of the main series' run. The first two episodes are definitely not typical of the series as a whole on that front.
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Vanadise



Joined: 06 Apr 2015
Posts: 497
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 2:38 pm Reply with quote
jr240483 wrote:
(considering that both the light novels and the manga had gotten the MA FOR MATURE AUDIENCES ONLY rating )

As far as I'm aware, all of the light novels have a T rating. Many volumes of the manga are rated M, but a few are just T. The artist for the manga definitely likes to make things a bit, well, spicier than the LNs or anime ever get, though.
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MFrontier



Joined: 13 Apr 2014
Posts: 11279
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2024 7:43 pm Reply with quote
I really liked how they conveyed the mutual loneliness both Holo and Lawrence feel, and Holo basically pours her heart out, as they really emphasize how important their mutual companionship to each other is. So much so that Lawrence's dream of building his own shop and settling down ends up amount to just a rag for Holo to dry her face with to comfort her.

This episode just did a great job really developing both the emotional and physical intimacy between our leads. They were even still flirting while on the run from thugs!
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Minos_Kurumada



Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 1015
PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 3:05 pm Reply with quote
"I'll describe an adaptational edit I dislike because both the light novel and the 2008 anime have Holo explain that she caused the occasional bad harvest to let the soil rest."

Uuuh... now I think I am going crazy because I am quite sure Holo do mentions this in episode 1 (never read the novel, manga nor watched the OG anime but remember the scene quite clear).

----

Anyways, Holo getting mad because Lawrence used nerdy business negotiation instead of becoming a W40K hero of legend to rescue her was funny, wouldn't surprise me if she allowed herself to be captured just to see it.

I also suppose she kissed her rescuer thinking it was him?

Or that was the implication, dunno.
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Key
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PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 3:46 pm Reply with quote
Minos_Kurumada wrote:
I also suppose she kissed her rescuer thinking it was him?

Or that was the implication, dunno.

Nah, she was probably embarrassed that she got visibly excited about her rescuer arriving (or perhaps even calling him by name), only for it to be a case of mistaken identity. Remember, Holo is practically an incarnation of Pride as much as she is an incarnation of a great wolf.

And yeah, my first thought on seeing Holo's little ear dance is that it would be one of the most viral scenes of the whole Spring season. People will be playing clips of that for years to come.
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MFrontier



Joined: 13 Apr 2014
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PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 4:08 pm Reply with quote
Lawrence using all his merchant know-how to come up with a plan to make a good business deal all the while avoiding any trouble from the church. And Milone Trading gets to strut their stuff.

Holo is a romantic. She really wanted her "mate" to come in guns blazing and rescue her in the most manly way possible. Instead she'll have to settle for trudging through a catacomb and faking a burglary. But the intent is appreciated.

Yarei gonna Yarei. Finally sees proof Holo exists but then immediately doubles down on his obsession with moving past the Gods. I don't expect a warm reunion with Lawrence.

Look at these two downplaying their feelings like tsundere's. But Lawrence is putty against Holo's charm and cute face.

Your life is not complete until you see Holo's little dance.
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Daerian



Joined: 04 Dec 2011
Posts: 168
PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 5:19 pm Reply with quote
Minos_Kurumada wrote:

Uuuh... now I think I am going crazy because I am quite sure Holo do mentions this in episode 1 (never read the novel, manga nor watched the OG anime but remember the scene quite clear).


She did. It was clearly stated by her in this version.

Is there a possibility of write-up being updated? It's entire paragraph against series based on Steve Jones forgetting part of previous episode.
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Joe Mello



Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 2262
Location: Online Terminal
PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 6:54 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
And yeah, my first thought on seeing Holo's little ear dance is that it would be one of the most viral scenes of the whole Spring season. People will be playing clips of that for years to come.

I am probably in the wrong circles because Delicious in Dungeon has sucked up all of the air in the places I frequent.
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Thesarum



Joined: 25 Mar 2022
Posts: 408
PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 7:03 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
I like that Lawrence has to use his wits to desperately bargain with his ostensible allies; the Milone Company's calculations are cold and impersonal, but they're befitting of a trade guild. In other words, Lawrence has to think and act like a business to get what he wants as a person.


I think there's a nice subtlety to this exchange (though it is a helluva lot of talking). The regional head of the Milone company gives Lawrence lots of opportunities, and shows all his cards. He must make his decisions in the best interests of the company, but as a person he has great sympathy for Lawrence and wants to help him. He just needs Lawrence to make him do it.

Quote:
We learn quite a few details about royal instability, mercantile gambits, the information economy, and the importance of the Church in society, politics, and business


Yes, this nicely sets out the politics and economics of the setting. The power of kings is on the wane, the real power sits with merchants and the church. A mid sized trading company can turn up and demand an immediate audience with the king, and expect to be able to leverage him into trading mining rights and other favours. The Trenni King might be in an especially weak position due to his financial difficulties... but if the other countries aren't already knocking down his door with an army that implies they're no doing much better. Meanwhile the Church is a sleeping giant, and should they rouse it, the church could easily crush trading companies and kings alike.

Quote:
Big things go down in this week's Spice and Wolf, and by that, I mean that Holo does an adorable little dance by wiggling her ears.


This is quite possibly my new favourite thing in all of anime. It's gloriously silly, and totally adorable.
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